I am a bit confused about oestrogens (or estrogens for non UK people!). I used to take synthetic oestrogen, but have now stopped that and just use progesterone cream. I did order a tube of 'phyto-oestrogen cream' from Serenity, and put it in my bathroom waiting to see if I need it. Two questions: What exactly  is phyto-oestrogen, and how will I know if I need it??? Also, how can I judge what is a good oestrogen cream, and how much should I use anyway? Or do I need to use any? I feel generally a million times better than I did pre progesterone cream, so I probably should leave things well alone! But I'm curious and who knows - I might feel even better with the addition of oestrogen!Any comments?

Well Jools you have just reminded me to look in MY bathroom drawer.

I did the same as you --since I am happily taking natural progesterone by itself and sleeping just fine, I thought perhaps a tube of estrogen would be dandy to have in the house.

So I tried it once. And that was it. I thought at the time it caused my face to flush, but it didnt.

I havent touched it since I went through my sessions with niacin --which caused a red face which I at the time I thought was a HOT FLASH--!!

What ? a HF while taking natural progesterone cream?? Not very likely..

So I put that little tube of estrogen away and forgot about it.

I learned then that my red face was from the niacin in my vitamin B pill (stopped that

I think I will put a little bit of estrogen cream on at the same time as the progesterone!!

'll let you know how it goes.

SandyXXXXX

Hi Jools and Sandy,

As you know, I used progesterone cream about eight months with tremendous relief.  Then I started having hot flashes and vaginal pain  so I had to consider some kind of estrogen too.  

I would stay with the progesterone cream only unless you start having flashes.   I theorize that at first you are estrogen dominant when the progesterone drops rapidly before the estrogen does.   Then after a while the estrogen drops too low too and maybe a very small dose of natural estrogen or plant estrogens would help.

In my case, the estriol at 2 mg. which is equivalent to .25 mg estradiol has helped the hot flashes a lot.  I still have them occasionally but not all during the day and night which was keeping me from sleeping.  So I think I may have found balance again for the most part....I think we have to keep adjusting it and going by how we feel.

My hormone test (saliva) did show a drop from 7 to l on the estrogen scale which may have accounted for the new symptoms of hot flashes and vaginal problems.

I think if you don't have hot flashes or vaginal dryness yet I would wait until you need it.

Life-flo makes Estro-Care which has estriol in it for those wanting a phytoestrogen that is topical too.  I have not tried it since my compounded is so much cheaper and seems to be working.

I tried Promensil and had fast heart rate with it; also there is black cohosh for estrogenic effects.

Doing a saliva test while you feel good would be a good idea for it shows where your levels are when you feel ok.  That is what I did and the drop in estrogen did show up.

I still have phantom period symptoms some but I hate to think how I would be without the natural hormones to help level me out. Glad you are both doing so well.   It could be that you will only need the progesterone cream....I had hoped that would be the case for me.....you never know about all this hormone business.  I think it keeps changing...

Thanks - I think you're right that it's a question of balancing, and maybe I'm balanced okay for the time being....well, hormonally speaking, anyway LOL!!!

Yeah I guess if it aint broke dont fix it!!!

So just natural progesterone for me ...

Sandy XXXXX

Yeah, and since my early days of perimenopause have long been over, I found it necessary to add some form of estrogenic therapy. In the early stages of perimenopause when your estrogen levels are still fairly decent, sometimes you can get away with just natural progesterone cream. Unfortunately, NP cream never did that much for me, but I've found tremendous results with Revival -- soy protein and isoflavones. It's been a Godsend.