Of all the discussions in this forum...this one on dryness seems right up my alley!! I think I am in perimenopause about a year or two. I think my problems stem from either menopausal dryness or atrophying (sp). My troubles started with what I thought was a bladder infection the day after having sex, All the usual symptoms except no pain that I normally get with a bladder infection. The irratation felt better after i peed but quickly returned. Cultures showed no infection. The symptoms went on for a month then slowly went away only to return again days later. My GYN had no idea what was wrong (she thought any menopausal irritaion would be on the outside, not the inside?)...i should see a urologist she said. I haven't done that yet but when I have symptoms, my urethra feels irritated just inside the opening which is very bothersome to me. This comes and goes. I have realized that close fitting pants can bring it on, whether it be undies or jeans. Also, sex seems to bring it on even though I use a lubricant. Although, sometimes it occurs and I don't know why.

What do you think? Would a couple years of slipping into menopause would cause my problems? Am I drying up and atrophying already only 2 years into menopause?

signed, happy Delma (because my urethra isn't burning or irratated today... YAY!! )

I dont think feminine dryness would affect you there, either. Could it be whatever lubricant you are using is causing the irritation?

Tight clothing down there doesnt help when we are irritated for whatever reason. I had suffered with irritations..which turned out to be psoriasis. I wasnt irritated, tho..where you are. Heh..thats probably the only spot down there..that wasnt. I hung around with pantiless wearing skirts or a nightgown, whenever I was home.

My gyno didnt know what I had either..but they told me I could use a little over the counter cortisone cream on down there for irritation. That really helped me..and turns out..it would have cleared me up if I used it more that a day at a time..lol..because thats how they treat what I have.

Also..what you "wipe" dont actually wipe..try blotting, instead.

You might want to change your lubricant and see what happens...but if this continues, I would go to the urologist. It took me 2 1/2 years of burning on and off..to finally go to a dermatologist..who diagnosed and helped me. If you dont have a yeast or bacterial infection, seems to me that the gynos are clueless. We seem to think they know about everything that affects us down there..but I guess they dont. Going to the right specialist will really make the difference. It did for me.

Hi Delma

I speak as a vetarean sufferer of vaginal atrophy and can confirm that it certainly can affect the bladder and urethra as well.

The tissue and the linings are the same type as the vagina and need oestrogen to keep moist and plumped up. Lack of oestrogen makes them dry and more prone to irritatiion and infection. If the vulva area outside feels very dry to the touch, it is also a good indication that the insides are in trouble too. I am very surprised that your GP does not know this???!!

If you google vaginal atrophy of visit the http://www.aafp.org/afp/20000515/3090.html link for a very comprehensive article. It will explain all!!

I am currently using Vagifem vaginal oestrogen tablets and am noticing a great improvement. I hope you get this sorted out soon as I know how miserable a condition it is.

I just wanted to chime in real quick. I have suffered it all UTI'S, DRYNESS, The works. This is what has helped me. Oh by the way my sister who is in menopause does have the dryness to.
I am still in peri but still have had these issues.
Recently I discovered replens, now many women dont seem to like it because sometimes you do get a lil discharge of pink or orangeish trust me I dont care. It worked. The main thing that really really helped me recently is CALENDULA OINTMENT I buy the brand name Hylands. It is 50 times stronger than Vit E and has saved my life.
Now what I do is just dab some in the morning after my morning Pee,
Then sometimes I dont need anymore til nitetime or sometimes days.
It has an earthy fragrance and is the best thing ever. I rub it in real good into all the vagina walls and the outside.
I also take cranberry supplements, wear loose clothing, stopped drinking coffee and dark sodas.
There are many irratants to this area.
Also I use kyjelly as a lubricant before a joyful time with hubby as to not irratate that area.
It feels real cool when you put it in there.
Hope this helps from a long time sufferer.
One more thing I take Fish oil supplements Omegas 3's .
Take care,
Tinks

THanks so much to tinkybug, scriv and just ducky for the feedback!!...your responses led me on a little bit of a website journey researching my problem.
I read that about 40% of women feel this way during menopause...only 25% ever see a doc about though. One site said that sex is good for this problem...my hubby will be happy to hear that one!
First, I would like to try moisturing the vulva area....maybe into the vagina, too. I believe this irratation is spreading to the whole area now....kinda feels singed. Thanks for metioning REPLANS tinkybug!...that looks like a possibility....but costs $12.

What do you think about using vitamin E. Would this be as effective...probably messier though to squeeze those little pills!!
Any ideas on Vitamin E??

Yes Vit E was good for a while for me but it is very messy and sticky please consider the Calendula ointment you have nothing to lose but the pain. It isnt expensive you can google the brand name. I buy it at a health food store called Herbies in my area I am sure you can find it even though its a different brand.
Yes sex is good for this problem also.
I use to think it was a uretha problem to because it all gets so sore up there but I did use this ointment on the iside first then reapply more to the outside, it is so very soothing.
So now remember if you happen to use condoms this should not be used with it as someone mentioned because it can comprmise the effectiveness of the condom. I use it durring the day and sometimes after my evening Pee cause seems like sometimes I have a lil extra burning pee, sorry.
Anyway you have nothing to lose, now on the replens I know walmart has it for cheaper about 10.50 I believe I just bought some yesterday.
I went to so many docs and no one could solve my pain but my own research and reading alot, a whole lot of reserach and trial and error.
Keep me posted and go out and buy that ointment it works for me.
Tinks

Yes, these are all worth trying, to see what helps. Unfortunately, I am hypersensitive and the only products I can tolerate around and in that area are KY Jelly and Vagifem.

So glad this thread was in the newly posted line!!!
I too, @40 and into peri for a few years now. Am experiencing this very thing!
Docs gave me meds for a UTI . And well, it still kinda hurts/burns/itches here and there.
I have a bottle of Vit E, which I heard from here or someplace else that you can insert it and it is supposed to
help down there inside. I did use it a few times when hubby and I had a weekend alone.
Everything went fine then.
So thanks for the heads up, I'll add replens to my notepad!

Msjen,
If you did well with the Vit E you should do just fine with the Calendula ointment it is even more soothing than the Vit E and not sticky, good luck.
Tiniks

If you only want to moisturize down there..and not use anything that protects..like something with a vaseline consistancy..I use a product ffound on the net called creme de la femme. This is a very light ointment which, I believe is made from petroleum jelly, mineral oil and parafin. It has no smell and feels natural..in other words..you dont feel that goopy or greasy feeling that you would with heavier ointments. And it wont stain your undies.

This is not good if you are trying to protect an already badly irritated area..like what tinky was saying..a burning. If it burns when you urinate..this doesnt help protect the area much..you would need something more greasy.

But, this is good if you want something to use down there, as a moisturizer, similar to how we moisturize the rest of our skin. It takes away that dry feeling we get sometimes. You can also use it as a lubricant for intimate moments.

The last time I ordered some..a month or so ago..they were offering a tiny sample for a penny. I dont know what the mailing charge would be on that, tho.

I tend to agree with tinky. The vitamin e is messy. I had bought the oil, too..that didnt help my problem any tho. I didnt care for the replens. That also burned me and the red-orange streaks in the discharge scared me to death. Also, I believe thats for those who are dry on the inside.

Gawd, listen to some of us. I will bet ya the pharmacy dept of walmart loves us. We probably all bought one of everything they had..lol

I would give some of this stuff a try..and see if it helps...if not..then at some point, maybe a urologist is the way to go.

Glad I read this. I have the same problem and have been living with it for far too long. Where do you find products such as Calendula ointment, Replens, others? A quick visit to Target and the grocery store's pharmacy turned up nothing. I'll try the drug store chains tomorrow. I'm assuming these are OTC products.

An alternative to Replens (with which some women seem unhappy) which was recommended to me by my doctor is Phyto Soya vaginal gel by Arkopharma which contains soya isoflavones. Like Replens you squirt it into the vagina - twice a week. It says it "allows the formation of a protective and lubricative film that hydrates the vaginal mucous membrane, ensuring adequate lubrication and an improvement in the quality of the vaginal mucous membrane. The mucous membrane regains softness and elasticity."

Apparently it takes a month or so for its full effects to be felt. I've been using it for several months now. It doesn't produce an orange or pink discharge as some women seem to have reported with Replens, but a white one. I was very uncomfortable with external itching and dryness before I used it, and it seems to have relieved that as well, although I do still have tenderness around the urethra from time to time, so the suggestions on this thread will hopefully come in useful for me. The manufacturer recommends combining its use with their Phyto Soya capsules for increased effectiveness, which I haven't tried as yet. The vaginal gel has certainly done wonders for my vagina! I'm not taking any oestrogen supplements at all so the improvement down there is all due to this product.

I'm not sure if this product is available in the States. It's available from good pharmacies where I live in the UK and since the instructions are also printed in French, I assume it's available also in Europe. It seems to work out cheaper than Replens and you only apply it twice a week, whereas I believe you apply Replens three times per week? However when I did a cost comparison, I only compared with a weekly pack of Replens, which is possibly the most expensive way to buy Replens as I believe you can buy it in larger quantities which would probably work out cheaper.

Ok on the Replens it is very easy to find, go to walmart by the womens products like summers eve. In fact I use Summers eve vag. wash and its great instead of soap.
Now the calendula ointment you can google it, the product is made by Hylands its a yellow and white jar. I noticed your also in Calif. I am in So.Calif. There is an herbal store here called Herbies natural products you can google them to.
Now if you want you can buy any type of Calendula ointment at a health food store but I like this brand name cause it just works,
Good luck
Tinks

The creme de la femme is sold online. You can do a google search.

I must sound like a spokesperson for them..but it was exactly what I had been looking for..something light, that doesnt stain..and you cant feel it..to use between "burning" episodes..when I felt dry "down there" to the touch.

Matter of fact..I discovered it when tinky mentioned it..but it wasnt good for what she needed it for..so she continued to search for something.

I was about to try that calendula, too. I had already tried a couple of other things tink recommended. Only..thats when I found out I had psoriasis there..and got medication from the derm..to clear that up.

Hmm..how come men dont have to deal with this stuff? lol

Need some help!!!!!

As I read these posts, I am wondering if this is what is happening to me. Can anyone relate to these symptons.

First of all, I have noticed that I feel like I need to "pee" more often. The urethra area seems to be more "sensitive" and I almost feel like it's leaking??? Does that make sense?? I've never had this problem without a "bladder infection" which was treated. This doesn't feel like a full bladder infection (but I will get it checked out), it's just a very sensitive feeling in my bladder and urethra.

Are any of the ointments good for this, or cranberry juice type drinks. Thanks for any feedback.

Juliann

I just talked with a good friend this week who is experiencing these same irritations with her urethrea and the feeling like she has to pee more and "fast" when it comes on .. if that makes sense. She has found that she gets some relief from putting a tiny bit of estrogen cream on the urethra.

Thankfully, I've not had this happen yet - but I have had the annoying sensation of "fullness" even though I don't have to urinate. I took SO many specimens in, thinking it was a UTI, only to be told "no" . That was months ago and then magically, it disappeared. Then, last month, I had that same symptom of fullness and "just not right" as I had months ago. So, I chalked it up to perim and didn't take a speicment. You can guess the result - after 2 weeks and finally decided "I have to go check this out - even tho I never had burning, etc. - yet, UTI - and in the words of the doctor "It's a bad one - looks like it's been here for a few days or week or 2"!! I felt like I couldn't win for losing. What to do? 36.00 for every specimen check only to find out they're fine - so then, I don't take one it and wham - uti! Moan - this perim is the pits! kathleent

Hi Everyone! Finding this site has been great. When I saw this discussion about urinary issues and UTIs it really made me feel better. I have been having signs of perimenopause ever since having open heart surgery almost five years ago. I am now almost 39 years old. In the beginning the symptoms were very vague and tests really didn't show anything. Over the last two years or so I have really noticed many perimenopausal symptoms. I have talked them over with my gyn and he agrees that they are all typical symptoms. My latest symptom that has been bothering me the most has been the UTIs. About two years ago or so I started having symptoms of a UTI but only for a short time and then it would disappear. It always happened right after my period ended and before I would ovulate (mid cycle). Then I had blood in my urine and was checked for everything you can imagine. I went to a urologist and they found nothing wrong. One thing I need to let you know is that because of my OHS I take coumadin which is a blood thinner and the smallest irritation in my urethra/bladder and I will bleed more than the average person. The first time my urinalysis came back as not having a UTI. Every time it has occurred after it has been a UTI. About two years ago I had one UTI a year. The next year I had two in a year and now I have had two within 4 months. I am going to go see my gyn in a few days to discuss this all with him. It has really helped me to realize that this may be due to perimenopause. Before the UTI symptoms began I had been having quite a bit of itching on the inner thigh and vulva area during certain times in my cycle. My gyn told me that the itching is a typical symptom of perimenopause. There is so much more I could go into but I don't want to ramble on any longer than I have. I was just glad to see that there was a urinary discussion going on.

Take Care!

I am sooooooo glad to have found this thread! I have been so miserable for six months now and am now majorly depressed over the effect that vaginal atrophy is having on my life. I never even knew it existed until now that I'm suffering from it! I went through menopause very smoothly, so I thought! No HRT either. I'm totally terrified of that. Let me try to briefly explain what I've been going through. I need to vent so badly! On New Year's Eve(2006) I noticed burning when I'd void. I finally went to a nurse practitioner on Jan. 10th. She did a quick urine test (dipstick I think) and said I had no infection. She never did a urine culture. I was sent to a urogynocologist who I couldn't see till Jan. 24th! For those two weeks I was in such severe pain that I'd lay curled up on the bed crying out loud! My urine was cloudy and foul smelling. When I went to the urogynocologist she sent my urine for a culture and said I had a "nasty" UTI and put me on macrobid for five days. The symptoms never went away but she did another culture and there was no infection. She had me try estrogen cream...1 gram in an applicator three times a week. Each time I had a gallbladder attack 36 hours later, which at first was chalked up to "coincidence" but I quit the cream. She then tried a pessary for a week and it hurt my urethra terribly. So she took it out. She then said she didn't know what was wrong with me and told me to try drinking cornsilk tea and that she wouldn't have to see me anymore. I went to my primary care doctor. He did a cytology test on my urine. I had atypical cells...meaning possible cancer of the bladder. I went to a urologist and had tests done. CT scan, cystoscopy, bladder wash, cystourethrogram. All negative except for a "puffy" urethra(oh...and gallstones!!). The pain in my urethra was unbearable most of the time...like a bee sting and shooting pains. The urologist mentioned lack of estrogen and suggested estrogen cream until I told her about the gall attacks, which by the way IS caused by estrogen if stones are already present! So she said I should consider getting the gallbladder removed. So I did!! And it was nasty! I had a reaction to the anesthesia. I'm sorry..this is getting way too long. My primary care doctor sent me to a gynocologist. He too mentioned the estrogen...he was the first one to mention atrophy to me. This was just two weeks ago (june). He told me that the only way I'll ever get relief is by using the estrogen because nothing else I've tried (Vitamin E, KY moisturizer, KY gel) will reverse the atrophy and it just gets worse. So I am now using it for the last week and I cry every time. I am so afraid of the side effects and feel like I'm putting a gun to my head each time. But I'm so desperate at this point! I didn't mention my symptoms yet. I have urethral burning, a feeling of leaking(without actual leaking), a swollen feeling, pelvic pressure, rectal pressure (supposedly no prolapses..one doctor said yes, two said no) all the time. I can't sleep at night from the discomfort. I can't go anywhere. I'll end here since this is way too long. Thank you all for sharing and caring!
Steviechaser(yes...I LOVE Stevie Nicks! lol)

Hi Steviechaser,
Please do not panic too much about this. I went through hell with the same sort of thing last year, you can read my previous posts on the subject. And after having a few antibiotic courses, some of them long term, the thing seemed to have a mind of it's own. It has gone away now, Thank God, and I have this theory that it was because hormones were at a certain level at that time. Also, if the FSH in the bloodstream is thirteen times increased from normal at menopause, surely it must be passed out in the urine. Therefore the urine is made up of different substance, and this causes the irritation. Thats just my own theory though. But the main thing to remember is that this will not last forever - my doctor was a bit pessimistic with me, and I got very down about it, as she said it was lack of estrogen, and it wasn't coming back! But now, actually it has gone away by itself, I am taking no hrt, or treatment at all, just drinking plenty of fluid throughout the day, if I remember.
So if you have had all the tests and your mind is at ease with the results that nothing bad is going on, just hang in there. You do not see all 'old ladies' hopping around in agony! This does go away eventually!
Alfreda.

Hi, Steviechaser,

So sorry to hear about what you've been through. One of the bad things about it is that one can feel so isolated while dealing with it.

My story isn't as severe as yours. I quit hrt and could not believe the urethral/bladder pain that I felt. Went to gyno who said that vaginal atrophy was pretty severe (I'm 55) and causing the problem. Then, I had a bout of vaginal inflammation which was so painful that I lay in bed all day.

I have used vaginal estrogen now for months and things have only recently gotten better. I know that you're fearful of estrogen, but from what I've read, very little of Estrace (estradiol not premarin) gets into the system. I am still using Vit. E suppositories on alternate nights b/c things still feel irritated.

Take good care of yourself.

Colleen

Alfreda...
Your comment about old ladies hopping around in agony really put a smile on my face!! I actually do be looking at "old ladies" and wondering if they're in pain!! lol
I have a call in to my doctor right now asking if things get worse from the estrogen before they get better because I am in extreme pain with tons of pressure right now!
Colleen...thank you too for your response! I really truly appreciate the info from both of you! Now to see if the doctor ever returns my call. I just have to shake this depression that the atrophy is causing!
Steviechaser (Martie) Again...thank you both so much!

Stevichaser,

Sorry for all that you are feeling. There is a safer form of estrogen vaginal suppositories made of estriol that you can also use... it is usually available through a naturopath or special compounding pharmacy and it may be possible that your doctor has not heard of this.

The estrogen in our bodies are estriol (weakest and supposedly provides some protection against uterine and breast cancer), estrone and estradiol (strongest but not good to have too much of this).

I know you are afraid to take hormones, I'm on oral bioidentical hormones and before getting on it, I was totally against taking it but I had too as my symptoms prevented me from functioning normally. I am slowly being weaned form the hormones and have reduced my estrogen levels to half.

Do take care.

Plumeria