Vaginal Dryness and Soreness Options

[Heartsonfire]

Hello everyone. This is my first post here. I've been doing a lot of reading here and have learned a lot.

Here's a little bit about why I'm here. I had Leukemia and had to have a bone marrow transplant back in January. With all the chemo, it made me not have a period anymore, in other words sterile.

It's been almost a year now. Three months ago my vagina started to feel very sore especially around the opening. I couldn't have sex because when my husband tried to insert his penis, it hurt so bad! I finally went to my GYNO and she tried to perform a PAP Smear and just to have the Spect. in me was such agony that she had to stop. She told me that I was dry, so dry that I started to bleed just from her touching me. She put me on Vagifem and told me to insert one every night for 2 weeks and then one twice a week. I started on Saturday night and it is now Wednesday. 4 days.

When do you think I should start to notice it working? How long should I give it? 2 weeks? I'm just so desperate for my vagina to get back to it's normal self so I can resumme having sex again. Also, we tried using lubes and everything but it it just too painful. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Ohhh and I'm only 33!

[Nevermore]

Hello everyone. This is my first post here. I've been doing a lot of reading here and have learned a lot.

Here's a little bit about why I'm here. I had Leukemia and had to have a bone marrow transplant back in January. With all the chemo, it made me not have a period anymore, in other words sterile.

It's been almost a year now. Three months ago my vagina started to feel very sore especially around the opening. I couldn't have sex because when my husband tried to insert his penis, it hurt so bad! I finally went to my GYNO and she tried to perform a PAP Smear and just to have the Spect. in me was such agony that she had to stop. She told me that I was dry, so dry that I started to bleed just from her touching me. She put me on Vagifem and told me to insert one every night for 2 weeks and then one twice a week. I started on Saturday night and it is now Wednesday. 4 days.

When do you think I should start to notice it working? How long should I give it? 2 weeks? I'm just so desperate for my vagina to get back to it's normal self so I can resumme having sex again. Also, we tried using lubes and everything but it it just too painful. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Ohhh and I'm only 33!

Hello, heartsonfire,

Welcome to this site. I'm only a few days old here, myself. I use vagifem, also. I'm dried out just from meno (I'm 53). It was quite a shock to suddenly be like this, when I was always so sexual.

I think your gyno should have told you a bit more. It's not fair to leave you hanging.

The vagifem does help bring back the lining of the vagina. But it doesn't address natural lubrication. You need to ask your gyno if your treatments put you into surgical menopause. The lack/imbalance in hormones could be causing the dryness.

I'm sorry that's not more positive. Like many of us, though, you're going to have to keep bugging the doctors until someone answers your questions.

[Heartsonfire]

Thanks so much for your reply. I'm also just reading about Vaginal Graft verses Host Disease. I called my Oncology Dotor about the possibility of this being the problem. She is going to talk to my Gyn. Doctor to see if this could be the issue.

[Shakti]

Hi Hearstonfire,

Vaginal dryness is one of my worst symptoms and I do sympathize with you. I used Vagifem with good success but it took about two or three weeks to feel better. I have gone off it as I got sore breasts and worried about some of the side effects. There is a TON of good info on this site to help. I now use vitamin E capsules inserted and some really good salve for the outside. The pain can be really bad so I always use some kind of moisturizer such as the vit. E, salve etc. Some of us use Replens vaginal moisturizer and you can buy it at Longs, Walmart, even some large grocerey stores.

I have also read "use it or loose it", which seems frightening as a touch can be so painful, but if you feel comfy, use a gentle touch yourself or have hubby use lots of lube and be patient and gentle, never force. Read about Kegal (sp?) exercises. I avoid tampons, soap down there, scented products and wear cotton panties. I have found when I'm home, a nightie with no undies lets me "breathe" and brings some relief.

I hope that I helped a little and you can PM me if you need to.

Shakti

[Heartsonfire]

Hi Hearstonfire,

Vaginal dryness is one of my worst symptoms and I do sympathize with you. I used Vagifem with good success but it took about two or three weeks to feel better. I have gone off it as I got sore breasts and worried about some of the side effects. There is a TON of good info on this site to help. I now use vitamin E capsules inserted and some really good salve for the outside. The pain can be really bad so I always use some kind of moisturizer such as the vit. E, salve etc. Some of us use Replens vaginal moisturizer and you can buy it at Longs, Walmart, even some large grocerey stores.

I have also read "use it or loose it", which seems frightening as a touch can be so painful, but if you feel comfy, use a gentle touch yourself or have hubby use lots of lube and be patient and gentle, never force. Read about Kegal (sp?) exercises. I avoid tampons, soap down there, scented products and wear cotton panties. I have found when I'm home, a nightie with no undies lets me "breathe" and brings some relief.

I hope that I helped a little and you can PM me if you need to.

Shakti

Thank you so much Shakti! Yeah, I have worried about the "use it or lose it" lol I'm very relieved to hear that it can take up to 3 weeks for Vagifem to work. I guess I was expecting some wonderful next day relief. I think I'm going to try some Vit. E and see how that goes as well. Again, thank you!

[Gramz]

Vagifem has worked great for me. Being post menopausal and not using hormones my vagina began to atrophy. Just like you when she inserted the speculum it was so painful and there was bleeding. She had me use Vagifem nightly for 14 days and then twice a week. She also had me use estrace vaginal cream 2 to 3 times a week just at the opening to help the elasticity come back. It was about three weeks before there was any significant difference. She too told me that if you don't use it you will lose it and with regular sex the problem should not come back. We also have to use "astroglide" which is a great lubricant. I have not gone off the vagifem and I continue to use it twice a week. A loving, supportive and "PATIENT" hubby or partner really helps.

[Nevermore]

Vagifem has worked great for me. Being post menopausal and not using hormones my vagina began to atrophy. Just like you when she inserted the speculum it was so painful and there was bleeding. She had me use Vagifem nightly for 14 days and then twice a week. She also had me use estrace vaginal cream 2 to 3 times a week just at the opening to help the elasticity come back. It was about three weeks before there was any significant difference. She too told me that if you don't use it you will lose it and with regular sex the problem should not come back. We also have to use "astroglide" which is a great lubricant. I have not gone off the vagifem and I continue to use it twice a week. A loving, supportive and "PATIENT" hubby or partner really helps.

Granz, sounds like you had a lot of success with the vagifem. I found a good lube called Diva, it's seems more lube-y than the astroglide.

Here's the question, though: what exactly is the timing on "regular sex"?

Thank you!

[Heartsonfire]

Vagifem has worked great for me. Being post menopausal and not using hormones my vagina began to atrophy. Just like you when she inserted the speculum it was so painful and there was bleeding. She had me use Vagifem nightly for 14 days and then twice a week. She also had me use estrace vaginal cream 2 to 3 times a week just at the opening to help the elasticity come back. It was about three weeks before there was any significant difference. She too told me that if you don't use it you will lose it and with regular sex the problem should not come back. We also have to use "astroglide" which is a great lubricant. I have not gone off the vagifem and I continue to use it twice a week. A loving, supportive and "PATIENT" hubby or partner really helps.

Thank you so much for your post Gramz. I've read about Vaginal Atrophy and I don't want that to happen. She didn't give me any vaginal cream to go with the Vagifem. But when I go back to her in 2 weeks I'm going to ask aout that.

[Gramz]

Nevermore.....My doctor says to shoot for twice a week. My hubby and I are raising two grandkids so twice a week is a little hard to do but we are keeping with once a week. Nothing like it was 15 years ago but better than it was a year ago.

Heartsonfire....the estrace vaginal cream is for the opening becasue when you have gone for long periods without sex the penetration can really irritate the opening and the cream allows it to have more elasticity. Hope it helps. It is worth trying.

[Heartsonfire]

Two more questions.

First, I've now been on Vagifem for a week and I've noticed that I have a pinkish discharge. Not all the time but some of the time. And the other day, I felt a little crampy like I was going to start my period. I haven't had a period in 4 years. Is this from the Vagifem?

Second question. I was finally able to have sex with my husband. We had to go really slow at first but I found being on top, I could control it better. But, I was really sore last night and I'm really really sore today. Will this get any better? I hate to think that I will have to suffer after every time.

[janet c]

heartsonfire-Hi.
I think if you read the information that comes with the vagifem it does say that you can have occasional spotting when using it. I used it last year but although it helped with the v. dryness, it gave me palpitations and very sore breasts.
I had to stop using it anyway when it was discovered that I had endo cancer . After my hysterectomy when my ovaries were also removed, I went into instant menopause which included atrophic vaginitis(which is the severe form of v.dryness and shrinking.)
I am not allowed any hormone replacement therapy (including vagifem ), so I went on a quest to find something to help, as I am not ready to give up on my sex life yet!!
I have tried Replens which gave me a horrible orangey discharge(yuk)and the usual things like Astroglide and other lubricants. The thing that has worked wonderfully for me is high strength vitamin E capsules inserted vaginally every night and also before intercourse. I also pierce a capsule with a pin and use some around the vaginal opening every night.
When I went for my 6 monthly check up recently, the doctor was impressed that I had no discomfort during the examination and it is all due to JUST vit. E oil!
I really recommend it. I find intercourse almost as comfortable as it used to be in the "old days" and I would not use vagifem now even I could!
It takes only a short time to notice a difference and it is risk free. Even if you carry on with the vagifem it will do you no harm to use it as well.
Hope that helps
janet c

[Nevermore]

Granz, sounds like you had a lot of success with the vagifem. I found a good lube called Diva, it's seems more lube-y than the astroglide.

Here's the question, though: what exactly is the timing on "regular sex"?

Thank you!

Sorry! It wasn't Diva (that's just how I recall it being listed at an on-line drugstore.) The bottle actually says "No. 9" and "Divine"

Sorry, sorry! Brain's not working.

heartsonfire-Hi.
I think if you read the information that comes with the vagifem it does say that you can have occasional spotting when using it. I used it last year but although it helped with the v. dryness, it gave me palpitations and very sore breasts.
I had to stop using it anyway when it was discovered that I had endo cancer . After my hysterectomy when my ovaries were also removed, I went into instant menopause which included atrophic vaginitis(which is the severe form of v.dryness and shrinking.)
I am not allowed any hormone replacement therapy (including vagifem ), so I went on a quest to find something to help, as I am not ready to give up on my sex life yet!!
I have tried Replens which gave me a horrible orangey discharge(yuk)and the usual things like Astroglide and other lubricants. The thing that has worked wonderfully for me is high strength vitamin E capsules inserted vaginally every night and also before intercourse. I also pierce a capsule with a pin and use some around the vaginal opening every night.
When I went for my 6 monthly check up recently, the doctor was impressed that I had no discomfort during the examination and it is all due to JUST vit. E oil!
I really recommend it. I find intercourse almost as comfortable as it used to be in the "old days" and I would not use vagifem now even I could!
It takes only a short time to notice a difference and it is risk free. Even if you carry on with the vagifem it will do you no harm to use it as well.
Hope that helps
janet c

Janet, I keep hearing you ARE allowed ERT with no uterus. Anyway, glad the vitamin E works so well for you. I tried it, but found it smelled funny. Which vitamin E are you using? And at what strength? Do you just put the capsule in there without piercing? Thanks!

[janet c]

I am not allowed ERT because my cancer was fuelled by estrogen.
I may be allowed it in a few years but not yet as it could feed any stray cancer cells.
I am using naturally mixed tocopherols(whatever that means) of vit E-1000 i.u. It is not branded. I buy it from my local health food shop.
I agree that it can have a bit of a funny smell first thing in the morning, but once I have showered it goes. Its not really a bad smell anyway.
The capsules are just made of gelatine and glycerine and dissolve quickly with body heat so I dont have to pierce. You might want to use a panty liner at night but during the day there is no discharge at all.

[Gramz]

Heartsonfire......I have been post for almost 6 years so maybe that is why no spotting or anything. My breast don't seem to be affected by it either. With regard to the sex....yes, being on top helps and is less painful. Like you it had been awhile since we had been able to have sex so we went at it very slowly. It was very painful the first time and it burned like crazy. Takes ALL DESIRE away when it hurts so bad....sort of like being a virgin again.....anyway, I was sore the next day as well but we continued to try and have sex every other day for a couple of weeks just so that the discomfort would go away and we wouldn't have to start from ground zero. It does get alot better....I promise you. Just takes time, patience and perseverence.

[Dearest]

Some of the most important information is not on the message board, but on the thousands of pages on the REST OF THE WEB SITE. This board is only a small part of Power Surge.

In this case: read this list of articles.

Dearest

[Shakti]

I have a question. I stopped using Vagifem and my vagina is dry and sore. I am using more natural products for management and they work okay. When I read about vaginal dryness I seem to read alot about sex and dryness. That's not so much my issue as I just use a good lube. I have constant soreness and burning, not just with sex but always. I have ruled out any other problems by the Dr. and have been told that it is common for some of us to get this with falling estrogen levels. I still get my period although they are irregular. I also have dry eyes, mouth and skin.

How long will this last? Do any of you hurt down there all the time? Will this only get worse as I enter true menopause? Will it ever go away?

Okay, more than one question burns in me

[janet c]

I have a question. I stopped using Vagifem and my vagina is dry and sore. I am using more natural products for management and they work okay. When I read about vaginal dryness I seem to read alot about sex and dryness. That's not so much my issue as I just use a good lube. I have constant soreness and burning, not just with sex but always. I have ruled out any other problems by the Dr. and have been told that it is common for some of us to get this with falling estrogen levels. I still get my period although they are irregular. I also have dry eyes, mouth and skin.

How long will this last? Do any of you hurt down there all the time? Will this only get worse as I enter true menopause? Will it ever go away?

Okay, more than one question burns in me

Hi shakti
As you may recall I have no ovaries and no HRT. I have the same problem as you. I find the oil works fine for the "inside" but I have burning and soreness around the outside , especially around my bladder. It doesn't matter what I apply there it always feels sore.
Why dont you ask your doctor to prescribe some estrogen cream and you could apply a little around the sore area only. I am hoping that I will be able to have some in a while but my surgeon says not yet because I had cancer.
I dont think the doctors like prescribing vagifem for long periods but you can have a break and then go back on it when things deteriorate again. I think that once through the menopause, dryness is always a problem, unfortunately. More so if you wish to continue having a sexual relationship. A lot of ladies give that up after the menopause but I do not wish to!
I have burning eyes also.I think it is very common
If you have a lot dryness, google sjiorgens syndrome(I think that is how it is spelled).
Best wishes
janet c

Its SJORGENS SYNDROME-just checked
janet c

[tinkybug]

I have a question. I stopped using Vagifem and my vagina is dry and sore. I am using more natural products for management and they work okay. When I read about vaginal dryness I seem to read alot about sex and dryness. That's not so much my issue as I just use a good lube. I have constant soreness and burning, not just with sex but always. I have ruled out any other problems by the Dr. and have been told that it is common for some of us to get this with falling estrogen levels. I still get my period although they are irregular. I also have dry eyes, mouth and skin.

How long will this last? Do any of you hurt down there all the time? Will this only get worse as I enter true menopause? Will it ever go away?

Okay, more than one question burns in me

Hiya Shakti,
Just wondering I also really dont have dryness with the sex but I use a Kjelly before so that covers that. I still have to work with the sorness and dryness but it has improved so much since the Replens and the salves and the calendula I have been using.
I think its just the way our hormones are putting us out of whack.
I make sure I dont wear tight pants or pantyhose will spark off some discomfort too.
I dont use soap there use the Summers eve vaginal wash now.
I dont know how it will be when we hit Menopause But I believe if we keep it in check now we should be ok, we just need to take one day at a time.
Tinks

[Duch]

I use vitamin e caps and, if I'm feeling sore internally like I did after taking the dogs on a 10 km hike, I use a little natural yogurt. Both are cheap and effective. Both tips I read in Dearest's columns. Link above.

[moonlight]

When my periods are gonna be close together(like 19-25 days)i seem to have no problems,but i can tell when i'm gonna have a really late period(like 40+ days apart)because my vagina becomes so dry that it feels like it's gonna rip when i walk......and it gets itchy and sore......is this caused from low estrogen?
Also,even using a lubricant,sex is uncomfortable....it dries up even with repeated application.....any helpful suggestions?

[XIII]

When my periods are gonna be close together(like 19-25 days)i seem to have no problems,but i can tell when i'm gonna have a really late period(like 40+ days apart)because my vagina becomes so dry that it feels like it's gonna rip when i walk......and it gets itchy and sore......is this caused from low estrogen?
Also,even using a lubricant,sex is uncomfortable....it dries up even with repeated application.....any helpful suggestions?

Hi Moonlight,
Your symptoms are most definitely caused by low oestrogen. When oestrogen drops the vaginal lining thins and it becomes very fragile. Decreased elasticity and less cervical and vaginal secretion will have a very negative impact on your enjoyment of sex. A recent symposium on menopause clearly stated that the use of oestrogen cream, applied locally was not only very effective but very safe. The expert concerned stated that he would even recommend it for ladies who had suffered breast cancer. I do not have vaginal dryness at the moment but If I did; I would ask for the oestrogen cream with no reservation!

Regards,

XIII

[moonlight]

Thanks for the info XIII....i had thought about mentioning the estrogen cream to my Dr. but for some reason i thought it would only be for post meno and not peri...

[ohsarah]

I had a real problem with painful sex after I gave birth for well over a year. Now i have breastfeeding dryness. The only thing that helps with sex for me is a personal lubricant called Liquid Goddess. Not only is it natural and works well, it also helps with fighting yeast infections. its absolutley the best thing I have come across…totally recommend!
sarah

[pikie]

heartsonfire-Hi.
I think if you read the information that comes with the vagifem it does say that you can have occasional spotting when using it. I used it last year but although it helped with the v. dryness, it gave me palpitations and very sore breasts.
I had to stop using it anyway when it was discovered that I had endo cancer . After my hysterectomy when my ovaries were also removed, I went into instant menopause which included atrophic vaginitis(which is the severe form of v.dryness and shrinking.)
I am not allowed any hormone replacement therapy (including vagifem ), so I went on a quest to find something to help, as I am not ready to give up on my sex life yet!!
I have tried Replens which gave me a horrible orangey discharge(yuk)and the usual things like Astroglide and other lubricants. The thing that has worked wonderfully for me is high strength vitamin E capsules inserted vaginally every night and also before intercourse. I also pierce a capsule with a pin and use some around the vaginal opening every night.
When I went for my 6 monthly check up recently, the doctor was impressed that I had no discomfort during the examination and it is all due to JUST vit. E oil!
I really recommend it. I find intercourse almost as comfortable as it used to be in the "old days" and I would not use vagifem now even I could!
It takes only a short time to notice a difference and it is risk free. Even if you carry on with the vagifem it will do you no harm to use it as well.
Hope that helps
janet c

What strength vit E??????

[Jan677]

heartsonfire-Hi.
I think if you read the information that comes with the vagifem it does say that you can have occasional spotting when using it. I used it last year but although it helped with the v. dryness, it gave me palpitations and very sore breasts.
I had to stop using it anyway when it was discovered that I had endo cancer . After my hysterectomy when my ovaries were also removed, I went into instant menopause which included atrophic vaginitis(which is the severe form of v.dryness and shrinking.)
I am not allowed any hormone replacement therapy (including vagifem ), so I went on a quest to find something to help, as I am not ready to give up on my sex life yet!!
I have tried Replens which gave me a horrible orangey discharge(yuk)and the usual things like Astroglide and other lubricants. The thing that has worked wonderfully for me is high strength vitamin E capsules inserted vaginally every night and also before intercourse. I also pierce a capsule with a pin and use some around the vaginal opening every night.
When I went for my 6 monthly check up recently, the doctor was impressed that I had no discomfort during the examination and it is all due to JUST vit. E oil!
I really recommend it. I find intercourse almost as comfortable as it used to be in the "old days" and I would not use vagifem now even I could!
It takes only a short time to notice a difference and it is risk free. Even if you carry on with the vagifem it will do you no harm to use it as well.
Hope that helps
janet c

Just curious, would Vit. E oil from a bottle work or does it have to be the capsules? I already have some in the bottle for scar prevention and I could try that tonight if it would work.

[runr]

Jan,
It's kind of quiet around here today, so, I'll respond! I think it's worth a try. Sounds a little messy, though. If you are thinking about buying capsules, you might want to get suppositories instead. I remember someone mentioned somewhere that the capsules are not as strong as suppositories. I purchased a box of 12 "Key-E Carlson suppositories with Natural Vitamin E" from a local Mustard Seed health food store. They have 30 iu of vitamin E, with a base of coconut and palm oils. I don't need them just yet, but wanted in have them available, just in case!

In case you end up buying the capsules, I found the following info from the topic area of this section, "Vaginal dryness and Soreness":

"You can insert a vitamin E capsule intravaginally for lubrication and to ease the pain of dryness. No need to break open the capsule; the pH of your body will do the job. This is one of the least expensive, most natural and effective ways of treating vaginal dryness. Just check the outer coating of the capsule first to make sure there are no sharp areas, so that you don't scratch the vaginal area when inserting. You can also cut open the capsule and place the vitamin E oil in the palm of your hand, then put some on your finger and insert it into your vagina. Again, make sure you have no nails that are sharp which might cause scratching or irritation."

good luck!
jem

[Jan677]

Jan,
It's kind of quiet around here today, so, I'll respond! I think it's worth a try. Sounds a little messy, though. If you are thinking about buying capsules, you might want to get suppositories instead. I remember someone mentioned somewhere that the capsules are not as strong as suppositories. I purchased a box of 12 "Key-E Carlson suppositories with Natural Vitamin E" from a local Mustard Seed health food store. They have 30 iu of vitamin E, with a base of coconut and palm oils. I don't need them just yet, but wanted in have them available, just in case!

In case you end up buying the capsules, I found the following info from the topic area of this section, "Vaginal dryness and Soreness":

"You can insert a vitamin E capsule intravaginally for lubrication and to ease the pain of dryness. No need to break open the capsule; the pH of your body will do the job. This is one of the least expensive, most natural and effective ways of treating vaginal dryness. Just check the outer coating of the capsule first to make sure there are no sharp areas, so that you don't scratch the vaginal area when inserting. You can also cut open the capsule and place the vitamin E oil in the palm of your hand, then put some on your finger and insert it into your vagina. Again, make sure you have no nails that are sharp which might cause scratching or irritation."

good luck!
jem

Thanks runr,
I tried the Vit. E oil I have on hand last night and it seems to help soothe the tissues. As soon as I get a chance I'm going to see if I can find the suppositories you mentioned. That sounds like it would help quite a lot and since my problem isn't bad yet and only occasional that would be good to have handy.
Jan

[momzoffour]

Qeustion: does orally taken Vit E tabs have any effect? Or I was told fish oil is also helpful?

thanks,
Momz

[tinkybug]

Hiya Girls,

I will add my 2 cents, what basically cured me was CALENDULA OINTMENT by Hylands you can google it, now it is 50 times stronger than Vit E, and vit E is great, It is made from marigolds read about it a year ago or so in a magazine for herbs.

Some girls are lerious about putting it up there but it works, I just massage it in real good and noticed that the dryness gets bad right before my period.

Now I have used it for over a year and lately I dont even have to use it at all even before my period I believe in my opinion for me it has healing properties in it , I believe the ol girl gets dry and crackly,LOL, and who knows what.

I do use royal jelly before a joyful time and that really helps alot, dont use the calendula with condoms though use it after because one of the girls once read it can interfere with the latex etc.

I sure hope I helped,

God bless you all

Tinks

[CSugarGrove]

Holy smokes--I forgot how bad a yeast infection can be. I've only had one before this, 20 years ago, because I was on a course of antibiotics at the time for something else.

At my routine checkup a few years ago, my doc recommended Premarin cream for dryness. I had no problems with it. I used it twice weekly, as the doc suggested, for over a year. Then I started missing an application here and there, no good reason, just procrastinating about it or thinking I didn't need it. Finally I stopped using it altogether. I went another year without it until I began to have the dryness again. By now the tube had expired six months earlier but I thought it would be okay. I used it and a few days later I still had itching, so I thought I did another application and WOW! I got a honker of a yeast infection, so bad I could hardly urinate or even sit, and any physical movement at all bothers me. I endured it for a couple of days and then bought some OTC yeast infection medication which I'm still using, for three days. I am sore and thinking that if this doesn't go away, I will have to go to the doctor.

I'm wondering now how I got this--could it be the expired Premarin cream? It was only expired for six months.